Frustrated with harsh shadows! Help!

[jwbryson1]

Better? I got my hair light in place this morning.

http:// Taylor Hair Light by jwbryson1, on Flickr

 

[fjrabon]

^^^^
seems about 1/3 stop underexposed

 

[jwbryson1]

Agreed. Thanks. Tweak #2. My only gripe with this is that her skin looks a bit bright. I think that's why I tend to underexpose these shots...

http:// Taylor Hair Light 2 by jwbryson1, on Flickr

 

[ratssass]

...i hope your daughter is being well compensated :waiting::waiting::waiting::waiting:

 

[fjrabon]

I think the skin tone looks bright because of the black background. It's technically correct in your revised shot. You've stumbled upon the exact reason you don't see black backgrounds for portraits of caucasians all that often. With traditional lighting, it's hard to really get the skin tones to look right with a black background. When they're correct they look too bright. If you compensate for the background, it looks too dark. And finding a compromise point rarely works either. Black backgrounds work for very dramatic portrait lighting, but your traditional soft lighting portrait, you probably want a medium grey.

 

[KmH]

A guideline I used - facial skin highlights should be between 235 and 240 in the red channel. The darkest area, opposite the main light, should not be darker than 15 in any channel.

In the photo in post #18, the highlight on her right cheek measures only 186 in the red channel using ACR's Color Sampler tool.

 

[fjrabon]

A guideline I used - facial skin highlights should be between 235 and 240 in the red channel. The darkest area, opposite the main light, should not be darker than 15 in any channel.

In the photo in post #18, the highlight on her right cheek measures only 186 in the red channel using ACR's Color Sampler tool.

Yup, if you ignore the background, even that shot is slightly underexposed. Black backgrounds really mess with portraits.

 

[jwbryson1]

...i hope your daughter is being well compensated :waiting::waiting::waiting::waiting:

She has a roof over her head, clothes on her back, a bike, unlimited Xbox games, and it goes on and on.

If you don't like the images, go look elsewhere. :er:


EDIT: I am trying to learn portrait lighting and she jumps at the chance to pose and be silly in front of the camera. Being my model is compensation to her.

 

[jwbryson1]

A guideline I used - facial skin highlights should be between 235 and 240 in the red channel. The darkest area, opposite the main light, should not be darker than 15 in any channel.

In the photo in post #18, the highlight on her right cheek measures only 186 in the red channel using ACR's Color Sampler tool.

Keith, this is a bit over my head (I will do my research on your reply), but if good tones fall between 235-240 and she's at 186, doesn't that mean that it needs to be brighter? Am I misunderstanding your response?

Truth be told, once I learned how to get the blacked out backgrounds, I really liked them which is why I tend to shoot them. I have a white muslin and a gray/marble muslin backdrop that I hope to try later today for the first time to see what I get.

I assume to be sure to get really white backgrounds, I should shoot for the ambient light about 2 stops overexposed?

 

[Derrel]

I think you still have the main and fill lights too low, and too far off to the side...it looks to me like you are cross-lighting these...I think you'd do better to move to a single main light and no fill light. I do not really see any harsh shadows...shadows show us shape...

The catchlights in her eyes seem too low to me...and I can see two lights reflected in the catchlights in her eyes, and both lights appear too low,and there seems to be no shadow under her nose...this is not quite what I want to see in a portrait. The main light needs to have a "direction", from where it is coming from....but the fill light being placed identically, or nearly so, on the opposite side, is canceling out the main light's shadow-creation effect. So...I say, try it with JUST the main light on her face, and if you want that hairlight effect, well, keep using that. But I would eliminate the fill light.

I think what you need to do is get the main light VERY close to her, and a bit higher, so the light kind of "rains down on her" from an angle...and the angle I am thinking of is with the light high enough so that the main light's catchlight shows up HIGH on the eyeball,well,well,well above the center-level of the eyeball, and somewhere between the 10 to 2 o'clock placement. Even with shadows, that oughtta look pretty good. Look for a shadow to be cast by the nose; a shadow that comes downward, and slightly off to the side of the bottom of the nose, and which does NOT touch her upper lip...that is a pretty traditional main light height, and one that looks natural, creates sparkly eyes, and looks good.

Problems like those you are having are pretty common when trying to learn how to light using speedlights, with NO modeling lights, and no on-site mentor, and basically, on your own by trial and error.

 

[Dao]

I am not expert on this. But I think I may try to bring the main light a little bit higher (and closer) and aim down with a white reflector at her waist level to bounce some light back up.

Edit: Next time, I need to type faster than Derrel

 

[ratssass]

...i hope your daughter is being well compensated :waiting::waiting::waiting::waiting:

She has a roof over her head, clothes on her back, a bike, unlimited Xbox games, and it goes on and on.

If you don't like the images, go look elsewhere. :er:


EDIT: I am trying to learn portrait lighting and she jumps at the chance to pose and be silly in front of the camera. Being my model is compensation to her.

WOW..............relax,dude..........it was meant "tongue in cheek". my apologies....

 

[jwbryson1]

...i hope your daughter is being well compensated :waiting::waiting::waiting::waiting:

She has a roof over her head, clothes on her back, a bike, unlimited Xbox games, and it goes on and on.

If you don't like the images, go look elsewhere. :er:


EDIT: I am trying to learn portrait lighting and she jumps at the chance to pose and be silly in front of the camera. Being my model is compensation to her.

WOW..............relax,dude..........it was meant "tongue in cheek". my apologies....

No sweat---just working too hard for off the cuff comments like that. Plus, I had been drinking for hours at that point. I'm good now.

 

[kundalini]

With the last photo posted, you are still cross-lighting your subject, but have moved your Hair light to a position where it has become a Rim light.

I threw this together this morning. See if it makes any sense to you.

 

[jwbryson1]

With the last photo posted, you are still cross-lighting your subject, but have moved your Hair light to a position where it has become a Rim light.

I threw this together this morning. See if it makes any sense to you.

Graphically, it makes sense to me. Logically, it does not make sense to me because I have never seen a fill light (1) that far from the subject relative to the key light, and (2) located on the same side of the camera as the key light.