Pot calling Kettle....."Hello?"

[LaFoto]

Ah, c'mon Chiller, stay out of your coffin for yet another while, I'm always happy to see you around and was all :shock: and ale: when you said you'd leave back then. Don't.

And what you say is very right.
The new "everyone only wants everything spoon-fed to them"-trend on here with the parallel "...and-we-won't-serve-them"-one are not nice. I remember that also I once asked "What is HDR?" when the abbreviation showed and showed again and I saw those interesting pics by woodsac that no longer really looked like photos, but did, and did not, and then those letters, and I asked! Just asked. Did NOT go to "Google" to get flooded with 12.000 articles on the internet. But to "my" photography forum, the one that I go to IN ORDER TO also be able to ask something "stupid" (it is only stupid to those who KNOW, never to those who DON'T know). Then suddenly someone said "LDR" and I asked "So what is LDR then?" With a minute or two of thinking, also I could have DEDUCED that it most likely is LOW dynamic range, but I still asked because I was posting and the question came up that very moment.

Why do people join forums, anyway? Special, theme-related forums. Like a photography forum. To be told: just walk out again and into Google and look it up there?

Yes, after over 3 years on here, the same question DO come up over and again. But so what? Those were MY questions back when I was new, too!!!

 

[Chiller]

Hey, hey.....here we go again!!

In my book, "please and thank you" always worked........

My $.02.

Chiller....doesn't it get dark in there?????

Damn it..I broke a nail scratching at the lid. :lmao:

 

[Corry]

Hi Terri and Cory,
I in no way intended this to be a bashing moderator thingie, and I hope you guys don't see it that way at all.

Basically, I was trying to get us to police ourselves whenever possible. If we quit being mean to one another, we might be able to get some really cool stuff.
Corry, I hope your Grandma is doing better. Hugs......

I didn't think you were...this thread has been very civil (and I thank you all for that).

I do want to make sure EVERYONE knows however, not to think that the mods disagree. I personally have probably been the loudest (behind the scenes) when it comes to making this place welcoming for newbies. This is where I got my start....I don't feel I'm a great photographer by any means (but that's my own fault for not putting the effort into it), but I am a thousand times better than when I first started here. I want everyone to have a similar experience to mine, here.

I am glad that you are all calling for action from the membership as a whole. Without some self policing, a forum this big wouldn't work....think in terms of a real life crowd....you have 5-6 (or however many of us there are) 'moderators' and 20,000 in the crowd (or, even if you just take the several hundred unique visitors that log on each day). 5-6 cannot alone contain 20,000 or even a few hundred.

...with all that in mind....I've seen MUCH worse forums that let abuse go on and on constantly....though we do experience our problems, I think TPF is still a pretty good place on the net....and we have a GREAT group of members to thank for that. You guys, overall (every family has it's bad apples now and then! ) have been wonderful, and this place wouldn't be the same without you.

I am at school right now, and really need to start writing some scholarship essays, so I'm gonna end that there, cuz when I start getting mushy, I GET MUSHY!

 

[wildmaven]

Repeated questions can get old, but we all have that in our jobs. We just need to remember that, even though we've heard something 1,000 times, it's still the first time for that person. For example, at work I have heard "am I going to have a reaction to this" or "am I going to glow in the dark" thousands of times over the past 20 years. Do I roll my eyes or snap at them? No. Because this is a completely new experience for them and I should answer their question just as honestly and compassionately as I did for the first person who asked it.

It's an epidemic on the internet nowadays to be flippant with responses. I'm on a birding newsgroup and got an ID wrong after an hour of pouring through my field guides. Someone said, "why don't you use a field guide before reporting a sighting?" Today, I come on here and am told to practice more before posting something. What does this do to someone less forgiving? It makes them go away. Remember, that person you just dismissed could have one day been a top poster of the forum. Instead, you send them cringing to another site, where they tell everyone there, "don't go to TPF, they're horrible people" which isn't true at all.

It all comes down to the golden rule of treating others as you would wish to be treated. Remember you weren't born knowing what you know today. There is always someone better than you, and always someone just learning.

Marian

 

[elsaspet]

Hi Corry and Chiller, and LaFoto
God, you guys are so dead on.
Say we just logged on here today with the same abilities or lack of, that we all had way back then. Man. I don't know about you guys, but I'd probably have never shared another photo, ever, in my life. I would have been convinced I was too stupid to ever take a photo.
And I'd still be working at the sucky foam factory, hating my life.

But, we were fortunate. We had this really sharing group of loving and helpful people who assisted our growth.

Hertz, who had over 20 years of professional experience, and was a Professor in Photography, personally mentored me. Terri showed me how to do new things and think outside the box. Mentos and Tuna were way cool too. LaFoto and Corry, you were always that voice of encouragement saying, "You did good, but here's what I would do".
So many of you guys were sooooo helpful. And I asked all the same dumb questions all the rest of the newbes ask.....cause hey, I was a newbe.

The bullies forget that they asked all the same questions of their teachers. Maybe they didn't learn on the internet, but I can assure you their teachers rolled their eyes with all of the newbe questions. If they had a good teacher, they normally turned out to be a good photog. If they had a bad one, they are prolly working as a lab tech in Walgreens or something.

I am a member of MANY photography forums, but I love this place above all of them. This is were I feel I learned the very most. And had the most fun as well.

What I would love to see, is the regular ordinary poster like myself, stand up against the few ball wrecker bullies on here. Let's let them know that we don't want that here.

We want video and wiki!

 

[elsaspet]

And for the purists who learned "from the sweat soaked hours in the library", I'd say this: "Aren't you glad that some photog cared enough to write a book to answer all your "stupid" newbe questions?

 

[stellar_gal]

I have only been in this forum for a few months and it has helped me out so many times. I have not been told off (yet). I'm not ballsy enough to start something though. I always do a search when I need help with something, but I may not always use the right key words and missed the previous posts on my topic. For instance I just posted a thread for Help with beach portraits. I looked up beach and did not find anything helpful, so I sure don't want anyone telling me to do a search. I don't find it necessary to say in advance that I already looked on this forum and googled it, blah, blah. There is enough non-essential wording on the forum as it is. Those nasty replies do need to be stumped. I bet a lot of those that do it sure would not say that in a room full of people. Like you said- just don't answer it and someone that is happy to help -Cindy, ect- will be happy to answer it.

Cindy- on your last post-- YES! I am so happy for the photogs that write those books. I use those resources to the fullest and always want to send them a fruit basket to thank the authors in the end.

 

[terri]

I in no way intended this to be a bashing moderator thingie, and I hope you guys don't see it that way at all.

Not even a little bit, m'dear! I was just explaining it from an admin point of view, but I know you care about the forum and only wanted to bring something up that was bothering you. I hope you always feel empowered to do that - as well as take a stand against the bullying type of behavior you're talking about.

(Those days of seeing your pictures from your old job seem soooo long ago!)

Im not sure how many people are left from 2003( I think 4 of us)

That many, Carl....? I have you and Jeff in mind, for which I am most grateful. Chase doesn't count. :mrgreen:

 

[Digital Matt]

As far as the nasty replies, they are immature, unnecessary, and should definitely be stopped. I sit on the fence on the actual issue, however. I remember my humble beginnings in photography, and I do remember asking a fair amount of questions. I also remember doing a fair amount of the work myself. I got books from the library, and I scoured the internet and read every great resource I could find. I went to school. I worked very hard at it, and I still do. I try to be as helpful as possible, but when I see the same questions over and over, asked out of what seems to me to be apparent lack of any effort to find a simple answer, I skip that thread.

Some of what makes "old timers" on here angry is the lack of effort to do some of your own research. The simple answers, that can be found in any basic photography book, being asked again and again make one wonder, 'If you are so into this photography thing, why aren't you doing some research on your own?".

I want to help as much as possible, but I also don't want to spoon feed a bunch of people who don't have the passion to search out answers, and to take some photos and learn via self discovery.

All of that being said, I'm totally in favor of a sticky thread with a link repository. The first links should be to good photography books, with the recommendation to check your local library. If everyone on this forum had a basic photography book, or the coveted "Understanding Exposure", 90% of these questions would not get asked.

 

[jols]

As far as the nasty replies, they are immature, unnecessary, and should definitely be stopped. I sit on the fence on the actual issue, however. I remember my humble beginnings in photography, and I do remember asking a fair amount of questions. I also remember doing a fair amount of the work myself. I got books from the library, and I scoured the internet and read every great resource I could find. I went to school. I worked very hard at it, and I still do. I try to be as helpful as possible, but when I see the same questions over and over, asked out of what seems to me to be apparent lack of any effort to find a simple answer, I skip that thread.

Some of what makes "old timers" on here angry is the lack of effort to do some of your own research. The simple answers, that can be found in any basic photography book, being asked again and again make one wonder, 'If you are so into this photography thing, why aren't you doing some research on your own?".

I want to help as much as possible, but I also don't want to spoon feed a bunch of people who don't have the passion to search out answers, and to take some photos and learn via self discovery.

All of that being said, I'm totally in favor of a sticky thread with a link repository. The first links should be to good photography books, with the recommendation to check your local library. If everyone on this forum had a basic photography book, or the coveted "Understanding Exposure", 90% of these questions would not get asked.

i ask questions on these type of forums to get the answer i know i could look in a book but thats what the internet is for i thought.

which is the exact reason why i dont ask questions here and i ask elsewhere because of the reply above.

i dont want to read a book i want answers on the internet. and will get them where i can

 

[Chris of Arabia]

And for the purists who learned "from the sweat soaked hours in the library", I'd say this: "Aren't you glad that some photog cared enough to write a book to answer all your "stupid" newbe questions?

Not sure I'm a purist, though that is how I learned what I know. As an avid book horder I do appreciate the efforts that others have put into authoring their work, though I'm not sure that 'caring' is the prime driver behind it. I'm sure that like most of us, there were financial considerations behind their chosen profession, they may some of the fortunate few though who enjoy what it is they do.

 

[terri]

As far as the nasty replies, they are immature, unnecessary, and should definitely be stopped. I sit on the fence on the actual issue, however. I remember my humble beginnings in photography, and I do remember asking a fair amount of questions. I also remember doing a fair amount of the work myself. I got books from the library, and I scoured the internet and read every great resource I could find. I went to school. I worked very hard at it, and I still do. I try to be as helpful as possible, but when I see the same questions over and over, asked out of what seems to me to be apparent lack of any effort to find a simple answer, I skip that thread.

Some of what makes "old timers" on here angry is the lack of effort to do some of your own research. The simple answers, that can be found in any basic photography book, being asked again and again make one wonder, 'If you are so into this photography thing, why aren't you doing some research on your own?".

I want to help as much as possible, but I also don't want to spoon feed a bunch of people who don't have the passion to search out answers, and to take some photos and learn via self discovery.

All of that being said, I'm totally in favor of a sticky thread with a link repository. The first links should be to good photography books, with the recommendation to check your local library. If everyone on this forum had a basic photography book, or the coveted "Understanding Exposure", 90% of these questions would not get asked.

:thumbup: Well put and spot on, Matt. I wish all those who were coming from the same head space had your powers of reason and could skip a post and move on, before letting a slap come out.

 

[Chiller]

(Those days of seeing your pictures from your old job seem soooo long ago!)

That many, Carl....? I have you and Jeff in mind, for which I am most grateful. Chase doesn't count. :mrgreen:

Holy schmokes...

I am not afraid to confess that everything I have learned, has been on the forums, mostly my start at TPF. I know a lot of the members from back then( wow, I sound like a Grandpa:lmao are gone, but ya can never learn enough. I have talked to many members that dont have the confidence to post pics, and have wrote me in PMs, or some have asked, how to do stuff. I am no where near the techinical knowledge of Hertzy, or DMatt, but I still try to help.
Im am in no way angry at new members, and welcome them. Besides...the more darksiders the better. We can take over the forum then.

 

[Digital Matt]

i ask questions on these type of forums to get the answer i know i could look in a book but thats what the internet is for i thought.

which is the exact reason why i dont ask questions here and i ask elsewhere because of the reply above.

i dont want to read a book i want answers on the internet. and will get them where i can

Yes, the internet is a fantastic resource, and I encourage you to use it. I however, am not the internet, nor am I an encyclopedia. I am a professional who graciously lends his time here to help out fellow passionate photographers, and I'm not happy when I see that I am here to hold hands and spoon feed. I also encourage you to look for an English grammar resource.

 

[terri]

We can take over the forum then.

Don't tempt me....!