Regarding Supposed TPF Bullies and Abuse Towards Newbies

Mr_Mac · Dec 18, 2012

AgentDrex said:
Thank you Mr_Mac, when you say "I also believe that if you open the door for C&C you better be ready for it all and if there are any ambiguous posts, ask the poster what he/she meant instead of going off thinking you were just handed over to the wolves." I agree with that. I also believe we should not make them have to ask us what we meant. We should be the first to give meaningful critiques right off the bat. If there's time to type something vague, then there's time to type something worthwhile. That or don't type at all. Would you not agree?

Implicitly!

AgentDrex · Dec 18, 2012

There are some pompous twits here, But I am starting to enjoy giving them shiiiit back, And the rest of you lot are jokers, sarcastic,talented, bafoons... who obviously have been bantering with each other for a while, Well that is my month long subscription opinion

.. As for bullying, I have big shoulders bring it! I can't wait to start uploading photos taken on my new cam for critique from you old goats! I shall take it on the chin and better myself with the help of you all, That is the whole point of the site

Exactly, we are here to help each other. And yes, there will be some good-hearted be-littling amongst those that have been here for awhile and developed a kinship but that is not the same as belittling someone you barely know even if just in jest. Even if we can take the belittling well ourselves, this should not and does not give us the charge to go ahead and expect others to do the same.

manaheim · Dec 18, 2012

This thread is silly.

1. I rarely see actual abuse here. I see quite a bit of impatience, a fair measure of frustration and a little snark, but almost no abuse. 99% of the time the community here will TROUNCE anyone who crosses the line long before a mod sees it.

2. Supposing that you (drex) or anyone here has the ability to "not stand" for something, and that you or anyone would be able to choose what would or would not tarnish TPF is naive at best. You'd be about as effective in selecting what will be the next popular color in the world of fashion. You have little say and little perspective.

Most of the time claims of abuse are really just new people who think they're better than they are getting pissed off because someone told them that they're not. If it were anything more people like myself would have been banned long ago, because we are the offenders of whom the newbies cry about.

Derrel · Dec 18, 2012

shents said:
There are some pompous twits here, >SNIP

I love you Brits!!! And I am especially fond of your reverence for twits!!!

runnah · Dec 18, 2012

manaheim said:
This thread is silly.

1. I rarely see actual abuse here. I see quite a bit of impatience, a fair measure of frustration and a little snark, but almost no abuse. 99% of the time the community here will TROUNCE anyone who crosses the line long before a mod sees it.

2. Supposing that you (drex) or anyone here has the ability to "not stand" for something, and that you or anyone would be able to choose what would or would not tarnish TPF is naive at best. You'd be about as effective in selecting what will be the next popular color in the world of fashion. You have little say and little perspective.

Most of the time claims of abuse are really just new people who think they're better than they ate getting pissed off because someone told them that they're not. If it were anything more people like myself would have been banned long ago, because we are the offenders of whom the newbies cry about.

I HATE rabbits!!!

pixmedic · Dec 18, 2012

manaheim said:
This thread is silly.

1. I rarely see actual abuse here. I see quite a bit of impatience, a fair measure of frustration and a little snark, but almost no abuse. 99% of the time the community here will TROUNCE anyone who crosses the line long before a mod sees it.

2. Supposing that you (drex) or anyone here has the ability to "not stand" for something, and that you or anyone would be able to choose what would or would not tarnish TPF is naive at best. You'd be about as effective in selecting what will be the next popular color in the world of fashion. You have little say and little perspective.

Most of the time claims of abuse are really just new people who think they're better than they ate getting pissed off because someone told them that they're not. If it were anything more people like myself would have been banned long ago, because we are the offenders of whom the newbies cry about.

been waiting for Br'er Rabbit to chime in!
totally agree here. BUT, there is still the issue (which is brought up regularly) of giving "proper" critique.
the difference between saying "your lighting sucks" and "you need fill light to get rid of shadows, try a flash with a diffuser" is hugely different. Often times, just that little courtesy would stop an otherwise "flame" thread in its tracks. usually however, people seem either unwilling, or unable to give at least halfway decent critique. and strictly in MY dumba$$ opinion....if your ability to critique is limited to "your lighting sucks" or, "that crop sucks", you really should just refrain from commenting at all, and let someone that CAN actually C&C get in there and help before the whole thread burns.

Bitter Jeweler · Dec 18, 2012

This thread...

AgentDrex · Dec 18, 2012

manaheim said:
This thread is silly.

1. I rarely see actual abuse here. I see quite a bit of impatience, a fair measure of frustration and a little snark, but almost no abuse. 99% of the time the community here will TROUNCE anyone who crosses the line long before a mod sees it.

2. Supposing that you (drex) or anyone here has the ability to "not stand" for something, and that you or anyone would be able to choose what would or would not tarnish TPF is naive at best. You'd be about as effective in selecting what will be the next popular color in the world of fashion. You have little say and little perspective.

Most of the time claims of abuse are really just new people who think they're better than they are getting pissed off because someone told them that they're not. If it were anything more people like myself would have been banned long ago, because we are the offenders of whom the newbies cry about.

I hear ya. I'll repeat that I see no abuse here either. It really does seem to be the inflated egos of those who still have much to learn in this craft/hobby/profession that cry abuse when there really is no justification for it.

If there is abuse happening though (now, in the past, or in the future), it is my position (even though as you claim my perspective is limited) that we have to be together on the topic of bullying. Not just here in this forum but elsewhere as well. It came to my attention through this thread (silly as you may say it is, I will still believe it was an important discussion to bring to the table) there is still a long way to go to convince ourselves of our own power to change the world. Maybe I cannot predict the color of next years fashion or ... maybe I can influence it along with others. If one person makes a stand and others join in, then perhaps change will occur. To convince ourselves there is little we can do individually is almost the same as saying the word "can't". That's the banned word in the computer lab I ran for seven years. People could cuss if need be as long as it was not overt and unwarranted but they would get a talking to for saying "can't". I don't like self-defeatism if I can help it.

shents · Dec 18, 2012

AgentDrex said:
There are some pompous twits here, But I am starting to enjoy giving them shiiiit back, And the rest of you lot are jokers, sarcastic,talented, bafoons... who obviously have been bantering with each other for a while, Well that is my month long subscription opinion .. As for bullying, I have big shoulders bring it! I can't wait to start uploading photos taken on my new cam for critique from you old goats! I shall take it on the chin and better myself with the help of you all, That is the whole point of the site

Click to expand...

Exactly, we are here to help each other. And yes, there will be some good-hearted be-littling amongst those that have been here for awhile and developed a kinship but that is not the same as belittling someone you barely know just even if in just jest. Even if we can take the belittling well ourselves does not give us the charge to go ahead and expect others to do the same.

Thing is people with a god complex on here look arses anyway, Its nice to be nice, You can banter and critique in a funny way it would be boring else, if its plain ole rude and several attack the poor newbie, well shame on them, I have to say I did think there was a click when i started on here but have come to think, maybe they are just purely friends, and if you read some threads you can see some are funny!! , For every 10 that are helpful and happy to share lil tips, there is usually 1 pompous twit know it all that just seems to be here to talk purely to the professional photographers, and only talk to say something negative, But the helpful people out way the negative... another one month subscription opinion

kundalini · Dec 18, 2012

AgentDrex said:
I'm not saying anyone here is abusive at all. Like I keep saying, this place seems to be devoid of it (it is my first home after-all). Having said that, this thread did bring to my attention an almost lazydaisical attitude towards the subject of bullying and that is somewhat disturbing. I hope some of you go back and re-read some of what you wrote and see that I am not telling the truth. If this world is to get anywhere, it will be through bonding not through made up excuses to have ignorance towards the maltreatment of others. Hopefully the new year will bring new vision and hope to us all and that we learn to show love first regardless whether our minds trick us into believing they are undeserving of it because our hearts will know it's best to do so. Thank you all for taking part in this thread. This meant a lot to me.

Kumbaya MF, kumbaya.

[grumble, grumble, grumble] It just doesn't resonate the same when you have to use the abbreviation. [/grumble, grumble, grumble]

:sexywink:

AgentDrex · Dec 18, 2012

Bitter Jeweler said:
This thread...

I'm just a kid stirring the pot. Good though. An unstirred pot gets a film on top and nothing tastes right.

manaheim · Dec 18, 2012

runnah said:
I HATE rabbits!!!

pixmedic said:
been waiting for Br'er Rabbit to chime in!
totally agree here. BUT, there is still the issue (which is brought up regularly) of giving "proper" critique.
the difference between saying "your lighting sucks" and "you need fill light to get rid of shadows, try a flash with a diffuser" is hugely different. Often times, just that little courtesy would stop an otherwise "flame" thread in its tracks. usually however, people seem either unwilling, or unable to give at least halfway decent critique. and strictly in MY dumba$$ opinion....if your ability to critique is limited to "your lighting sucks" or, "that crop sucks", you really should just refrain from commenting at all, and let someone what CAN actually C&C get in there and help before the whole thread burns.

Sure, but again... Try to change it. I once came up with the idea of The Pact. Some people still have it in their sig. The idea was to establish a framework for behavior for requesters and commenters, and to get enough people to put it in their sig that it was constantly in everyone's face... Really the only way to even hope to bend a culture this large short of brute-force moderation... Which isn't TPFs MO.

The result? Hoo boy.

Lots of people got behind it, but a lot of people raised up pitchforks and torches and demanded my head. You wanna see abuse? Go look up THAT thread. I've never seen such vitriol here- before or since.

In other words, nothing you can do about it because it's mob rule and the average intelligence and wisdom of any mob is something north of a kumquat.

All this silly whining by noobs is frankly equalled only by threads that elevate it by saying "we must do something!!!". I see that now. I didn't then.

The funny thing about champions is that they're really easy targets for slung feces up on those nice white chargers.

Derrel · Dec 18, 2012

Bitter Jeweler said:
This thread...

You got copyright to that image, meeester???

shents · Dec 18, 2012

Derrel said:
shents said:

There are some pompous twits here, >SNIP

Click to expand...

I love you Brits!!! And I am especially fond of your reverence for twits!!!