Starting a System

[tirediron]

...Also with tripods avoid the newer manfrotto tripods with the centre column which can go horizontal. Its sounds good, but in practice the designe of the manfrotto grip that holds the centre column in the horizontal position is not that strong - and any pointion where the head is not right next the middle of the tripod and you can get a lot of wabble...

The older design is a lot more rigid, but I've used my 055 legs for macro work without any noticeable stability issues. This image was taken with the horizontal centre column at almost full extension and I think you'll agree is fairly sharp...

 

[jvgig]

I have read a few accounts regarding the 180mm size, but since it is only 70g heavier and less than 2 inches little longer, I do not think it should be a problem.

The tripod legs that I have currently selected does not have that feature. If the column is left vertical, is there any difference in stability form the only vertical variety? If not, the added flexibility, even at a slight performance cost when used, would certainly be a nice option to have. I am not a fan of the twist locking legs nor am I a fan of the price of the Gitzo system, so I am not considering them.

I briefly considered the option of extension tubes, lens reversals, etc, but since I know that I prefer to use photography to (attempt to) emphasis something that the eye cannot see, I know that I will be out to purchase a proper lens at the first possible moment. There is some inherit risk in doing it this way, but I feel as though I will be much happier in the long run purchasing fewer pieces of proper equipment than trying to make a full range setup on a partial range budget.

 

[davebmck]

Have you checked to see if the Canon ring flashes will fit the Sigma lenses you are considering?

 

[jvgig]

I believe that I would just need the 72mm adapter which runs about $30.

 

[jvgig]

Are the older design tripod legs available anywhere? model number?

On the newer design. Does the horizontal post clamp have any affect on the stability when vertical?

I am trying to order within the next few days, so I am trying to finalize my shopping list.

40D refurb- $650
sandisk III 8gb- $30
manfrotto 055XPROB or 055XB- $145
manfrotto 410 geared head (used)- $150
generic remote switch- $5
hoya 72mm s-hmc UV filter-$40 Is this good? Reviews are all positive.

sigma 180mm f3.5-$750
sigma 150mm f2.8- $630
I am still debating between these two. With the 1.6x sensor the effective focal length difference is about 50mm, but if you add a 1.4x to it, you get a 70mm advantage. For non macro shooting, the f2.8 may be useful. Looking at my current shooting options, my telephoto is all done at 3.5 max aperture due to lens limitations so I would not miss it, but it may limit my options until I can afford a 70-200 f2.8. The 180mm will be better in the long term (several years) while the 150mm will provide me some advantages in the mean time, but lose value once I expand my kit. The cost difference is not enough to allow me to get anything else, so that is not factor.
Anyone encounter a similar decision? What did you choose, were you happy about the decision?

I think I am going to go with the dedicated Twin Lite MT-24EX ($660+$30 adapter)over the normal zoom and 430EX II. The options it provides with two positionable lights will give me more options to experiment with and will make solo shooting easier than trying to fumble around with reflectors.

Price totals with 180mm=about $2450, with 150mm=about $2350.

Any other thoughts?

 

[Overread]

take a look at the giottos tripods - they are new to the serious tripod market, but appear to have a better design for the horizontal centre column (though I point out that I have not tried any of their tripods). I have read few reviews and people seem to be speaking well of them.
Best thing is to see if you can try out the options in a shop.

As for the macro lenses - I went on the recomendation that the 150mm was handholdable whilst the 180mm is slightly less than. I would say either one is fully capable of achiving very high quality results so which ever you go for is a good choice.

 

[jvgig]

Any thoughts on the Giotto MTL 9371B? I cannot find any reviews or many places that sell it, so I am assuming that it is a fairly new model.

 

[JustAnEngineer]

If you're going to have only one 150mm or 180mm lens, maybe you would like to add a second lens for $85 or a cheap pre-owned zoom for $115 to provide a wider view?

 

[jvgig]

Here is my tentative future list of purchases in order
1-normal zoom, maybe Tamron 17-50mm f2.8 w/430EX II
2/3- 70-200mm f2.8
2/3- MP-E 65mm with focusing rails

Since that will be my next purchase, I would rather not buy a lower grade piece of glass just to hold me for a little while. With hs graduation coming up I am planning on using a portion of the gifts to put towards the first upgrade, so it should be less than 6 months.

I think I am at the point where I will be happy with any choice that I make, so I will probably order in a few days. However, I would like to see some more info on the Giotto tripod to compare.

 

[Katier]

Little late in on the conversation, but why not go second hand on things like the flash and maybe even the tripod. Can get very serviceable items of both off ebay for very good prices and gives you more budget for the lenses etc.

 

[jvgig]

I am open to and have been looking for lightly used items; however, I have not found many of the more specialize items for sale anywhere. Currently, the only items that I have found at a substantial enough discount are the body and geared head. Otherwise, the price difference has either been so small ($10-20 on a $600+ item) that I could not justify taking the chance for the meager savings. Does anyone know of a reputable dealer that has the used flash, lens, or tripod? There are no camera stores locally, so it would have to be an online retailer.

I have been looking at the used sections of BHphoto, Adorama, KEH, and Ebay, but have not found any of the items that I am looking at.

I still have not found any reviews of the Giotto tripod, so if anyone has any experience with it, I would be interested in hearing some first hand reviews.

The more I think about the lens purchase the more I am thinking the 180 would be the better investment. Has anyone extensively used both who could comment on hand holding both with the MT-24EX flash, or similar, on the end? The weight difference between the two does not concern me as much as sticking the flash (I cannot seem to find a weight on this) an extra 2" from the body. However, i assume that the majority of the flash weight is located in the shoe mounted battery/controller so it should shift the center of mass towards the body more than the lights move it to the end, but as I have no numbers to base this off of, I am just guessing.

Thanks for the continuing help

 

[Katier]

Well Flash wise I would just go to ebay, and possibly tripod too. The risk for such items is rather less than for a lens or a body (and I've bought all 4 off ebay before).

 

[jvgig]

Any other comparable tripods to the ones being considered that I may have a better chance of finding used? I am not too concerned about weight, as long as it is not obnoxious, but I do not want to give up any of the flexibility or stability of the current options.

I have not found the MT-24EX used anywhere, any suggestions?

A few minor concerns that I believe I know the answers to but would like confirmation.

1 Can you use the lens hood with the Sigma 180 for macro without attached ring flash?

2 If I use the MT-24EX, the 72mm adapter that canon sells to attach it to their 180mm lens will work to attach it to the sigma?

3 If question one and 2 are yes, can the lens hood be used simultaneously with the flashes attached to the front of the lens, or would I have to rig the lights some other way?

 

[usayit]

Any other comparable tripods to the ones being considered that I may have a better chance of finding used? I am not too concerned about weight, as long as it is not obnoxious, but I do not want to give up any of the flexibility or stability of the current options.

Bogen/Manfrotto 055 Pro which replaced 3021 Pro. Make sure it is the "pro" version so that you have the option of an horizontal center column.

I have not found the MT-24EX used anywhere, any suggestions?

Just like the 65mm MP-E, it is kinda a speciality item and thus difficult to find used... you probably end up buying new. Keep an eye on ebay. I've seen a few there.

Other options would be to use a macro flash bracket and two canon EX flashes triggered by ST-E2. Probably be more expensive than the MT-24EX new but you can use the flashes for other types of flash photography.


As for the filter thread on the sigma.. according to sigmaphoto.com, the 180mm macro is also 72mm filter thread. It should work. I don't think a lens hood is necessary for macro.

 

[Overread]

personally I prefer to have a hood on when shooting macro work - its very usefull at pushing back twigs and such which would otherwise be hitting the front element of the lens. YOu can certainly use the hood with the 150mm (I shoot that way) and I would be very surprised if you could not shoot with the 180mm in the same manner.