The death of C&C

[Space Face]

Sometimes you need to be careful what you wish for. Other Forums are not necessarily always a good template to base things on imo.

I agree - the other forum referred to has nice software and some active members who provide good critique, but the Victorian-era sensitivity of the heavy-handed moderators were not for me.

It's not easy to find a forum where you feel 'at home'.

I absolutely agree. Many Forums have a 'clique' and members who suck up to the Mods. If you're not part of it or openly disagree with any of them or the Mods you're treated pretty shabbily at times.

I'm not just talking about photography Forums. I've been on many Forums whether it's photography, motoring, cars, bikes, motorhomes, football, golf, boats, fashion, music etc etc and they all pretty much have cliques, some more so than others. I tend to speak my mind and suffice to say I do not partake in a number of Forums on which I used to be fairly active. Make of that what you will

 

[gk fotografie]

Sometimes you need to be careful what you wish for. Other Forums are not necessarily always a good template to base things on imo.

I agree - the other forum referred to has nice software and some active members who provide good critique, but the Victorian-era sensitivity of the heavy-handed moderators were not for me.

It's not easy to find a forum where you feel 'at home'.

Please stay to the point! I'm in no way referring to another forum if that forum would be better, I don't even know that, I only point to the separate buttons applied on that forum for "full critique" etc. and I'm in no way talking about that forum anywhere as being better or whatever, because how or what that forum is does not matter at all here in this discussion.

 

[Space Face]

Sometimes you need to be careful what you wish for. Other Forums are not necessarily always a good template to base things on imo.

I agree - the other forum referred to has nice software and some active members who provide good critique, but the Victorian-era sensitivity of the heavy-handed moderators were not for me.

It's not easy to find a forum where you feel 'at home'.

Please stay to the point! I'm in no way referring to another forum if that forum would be better, I don't even know that, I only point to the separate buttons applied on that forum for "full critique" etc. and I'm in no way talking about that forum anywhere as being better or whatever, because how or what that forum is does not matter at all here in this discussion.

I think it is relevant to the point. A you'll see from my reply, I wasn't specifically referring to the particular Forum you mentioned. I was referring to Forums in general.

 

[photoflyer]

I guess one way to get it started is to provide a bit of self criticism of the image one has just posted. The weekly challenges are a great place to do this.

It's funny because as I've improved I frequently know the flaws in an image before I post it. Folks here have a good eye. On a Neowise shot I shared the foreground was blurry because I shot it on a sky tracker. I was impressed that someone picked up on this. Only someone here would.

And last week I posted something with obvious pincushion effect that I knew was there. Again, a discerning eye caught this.

In both cases I was impressed.

Of the top 10 favorite images I've taken each has technical flaws and folks here will see them. But an image is the sum of its parts and must be enjoyed that way. A little C&C won't detract from this.

 

[Space Face]

It appears from some of the replies herein infer, if I'm grasping them correctly, that it is assumed any critique or comments and opinions voiced are OP specific and don't have to be iterated more than once on different Threads.

I'm of the train of thought that this is not wholly correct. It may well be the case that an OP has read the comments and either agreed, disregarded, countered or acknowledged them and therefore does not require to do so again. However, I'd put it that any other person reading the Thread and subsequent comments written therein, may indeed venture on something of value to them, which they may use to their advantage at a future time.

On a busy Forum like this, threads tend to be moved on fairly quickly and any information contained in them, although obviously not lost, become less evident and current.

 

[weepete]

Personally I'm at the stage where I really need the nitpicky critique, so if I know what works or not in post, whither my content is up to scratch. I'm really looking to push myself here and I do kinda miss the days where it kept me on my toes.

I had no idea. Now that I know what you want, I will watch for your photographs in the future, and see if I can offer anything of value.

Thanks Designer, I'd really appreciate the feedback. Often in my own shots I have my own vision. It's not unique or breaking ground and I do still really struggle with seeing compositions. However I'm at the stage I want to be competing with the pros. Last year I put my money where my mouth is and I reallly want to push my photography to the best it can be

So to all those that read; I'm fair game.

 

[charlie76]

I disagree with this. Any critique could be considered opinion based. Blown highlights are a verifiable fact, but whether it detracts from a photo is only opinion.

I agree with your disagreement

 

[charlie76]

This touches on another very valid point - you get back what you put in, as with most everything in life!

Ya...agreed. Really, seriously dedicating your attention and time to giving a one or two paragraph critique on someones photo is a fantastic thinking exercise and sharpens one's sense for good art... IMO.

 

[charlie76]

There are many people who take up photography with absolutely no regard for over five centuries' worth of visual art. I have grown tired stepping around these people.

Gangsta

 

[weepete]

I think one of the things that's a bit misunderstood in this conversation is also around input from the person thats looking for C&C. Personally I don't want to bias the viewer, I'd like people to look at my shots with a clean eye and give feedback on what they pick up on.

 

[weepete]

There are many people who take up photography with absolutely no regard for over five centuries' worth of visual art. I have grown tired stepping around these people.

Gangsta

That's not helpful or constructive, and probaby what you don't realise is that there has been many an argument on here that's went; Art is subjective, subjective is opinion, therefore there is no right or wrong, therefore nothing is good, nothing is bad and it's all just a matter of opinion

Invariably that leads to a place where people can justify using bad technique as they fail to realise that the common element is the visual signposts we use as a common language in art.

 

[Overread]

I think one of the things that's a bit misunderstood in this conversation is also around input from the person thats looking for C&C. Personally I don't want to bias the viewer, I'd like people to look at my shots with a clean eye and give feedback on what they pick up on.

I often think this is an overplayed worry. You won't bias a person that much by your own viewpoints. It's more likely that your description of how you took it and your thoughts will better help them understand both your creative process and your creative eye and intentions with the photo. As a result the critique you get back would be more focused around YOU and less around them. This is important because many times when interpreting a work of art for critique the intention of the creator is important. If you are aiming to tell a specific message or story then if the person giving critique cannot see that story its giving context for them to give you feedback. If you don't provide any information they might go off at a total tangent based on the story they might think you wanted to tell or what they think is good to tell.

This can mean that things end up heading toward the "common" themes in creativity even if you were trying to work outside of the box.


Finally, as noted earlier, it also shows that you are willing to put the legwork into your own creative process. Its showing that you DO want to learn and that you are willing to put time into it. Plus its showing your thoughts; it might show where you're missing something or where you've got confused or have a gap etc... All essentially and really great information.

 

[Designer]

I think one of the things that's a bit misunderstood in this conversation is also around input from the person thats looking for C&C. Personally I don't want to bias the viewer, I'd like people to look at my shots with a clean eye and give feedback on what they pick up on.

That might work with some types of photographs, but I still think knowing the photographer's intent is valuable when considering his submission.

 

[charlie76]

It’s absolutely useful to know the intent of an artist, but it shouldn’t act as any sort of gatekeeper to restrict the opinions of others. Stating that a particular photograph “meets the intent” of the photographer, basically shuts the door to CC, which isn’t helping anyone.

I’d say the only exception to this is digital art. I think once you manipulate an image past the point of realism (to whatever degree) it begins to enter the genre of digital art. And digital art cannot be evaluated using typical photographic standards. And imo should have its own spot in the gallery.

 

[zombiesniper]

I think one of the things that's a bit misunderstood in this conversation is also around input from the person thats looking for C&C. Personally I don't want to bias the viewer, I'd like people to look at my shots with a clean eye and give feedback on what they pick up on.

For some images and problems this is the correct approach. As an example there was a thread where a background was composited in behind a group of people and the OP waned to see if anyone could pick it up.

However when it is just someone posting CC welcome, I usually tend to pass on commenting since it would usually take me more effort to critique an image than the average poster put into the image itself. This isn't always the case but how many times have you seen a newer member post CC welcome with no context on multiple started threads. I see a few a week.

Sometimes you can give basic info without influencing the viewer. Settings, Why did you take the shot?