What to charge?? - Starting out

SayGee

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Hi all,
This is my first post, and I'm trying to start a photo business, so please be kind.

By way of background, I've always loved photography, though it's only the past couple of years that I've been taking it seriously - leaving full automatic settings behind, switched from iPhoto to Aperture, and I enrolled in a comprehensive course. I should spend more time with my course, but both personal circumstances coupled with my learning style have me learning by doing, instead. I'm well aware that a SAHM with a DSLR does not, in of itself, qualify me to be a professional photographer. That being said, I've discovered that I do have a good eye and I'm developing my skill.

Over the past several years, I'd be the mom snapping pictures, not just of my kids, but others, too. In the past, I would post photos in a password protected online gallery (remember ofoto?) and email the link with password to the other moms whose kids were in the photos. That ended around the time I went from compact camera to DSLR and posted to a MobileMe gallery. My username notwithstanding, I absolutely love candid photos and strongly prefer not to force the contrived posed 'say cheese' makes me cringe. I also found both a love and a knack for nature photography (and would love to know how I can make money from some of those shots)

People around know I'm "an aspiring photographer" but it's reached the point of 'poop or get off the pot'

So here's where I am now, and my first of several questions:

One of the ways I've been able to learn by doing is by unofficially and officially volunteering at one of my child's school. Last year, I took pictures, and just gave them to the school. They have a website with all school relevant info and also where they post their own pictures (that the teachers take) - it's automatically password protected (PWP) as only parents of those kids can access it. But, the photos are linked with the ability to purchase, fulfilled by a 3rd party. (foreshadowing here)

While building a portfolio, I'm still shooting whenever and wherever I can (school events, birthday parties, etc). I don't want to just do freebies (at least not completely) anymore, especially now that people are making so many positive comments, I'm being asked to take photos and/or trusted to be designated photographer for a given school event. I want to use this as a springboard to being *hired*.

Since administrative follow through isn't really my strong point, and the irony of timing with MobileMe going away - I figured I'd setup a presence on Zenfolio. Last week, at the request of one of my children's teachers, I took photos of the kids during a special program at school. I haven't shown anyone the photos yet - and I also have a couple of photo ops in the next couple of weeks. I need to set something up NOW.

Though I haven't been formally *hired*, I see these as income producing opportunities anyway. I'm thinking I can and should post these events into their own PWP gallery on my about to be setup Zenfolio page - give the respective links to the teacher and PTO - letting them disseminate to the parents and if the parents want the prints, they can buy them. :playball:

I just don't know what to charge!! I want to set the prices to reflect a business - high enough to have my time be respected, especially since on these events and many future events, I'm neither paid by the hour, the event or having negotiated some package. As an example: for the school events, as both a thank you and a way to keep getting my name out, I would like to charge $X per print, where a percentage of profits would be donated to the PTO.

Magic question - how much is $X??:scratch:

Thank you, in advance, for your help on this, the first of several questions I have!
 
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Have you already purchased insurance, license, etc?
 
While I do appreciate and could use startup cost advice, I really need an idea as to what to charge for specifically the type of situation I described, where there is no contract and I am not formally hired. Forgive my ignorance, but I don't see how insurance affects how to price on a per print basis. Would you please explain and perhaps be able to answer my question under both scenarios?
 
Since administrative follow through isn't really my strong point...

This is a concern. Most photography businesses fail on the business side, not the photography side. There are a lot of things that need to happen to have a successful photography business beyond photographing and advertisement. Make sure these areas are covered. I'm no pro so I can't give you much in the way of specifics regarding price but once you start to charge, the expectation of quality and professionalism tends to go up drastically so don't short change yourself and remember to factor in overhead into the price. Everything from time from the shoot and post processing to wear and tear on your equipment not to mention insurance and licensing as 2WheelPhoto mentioned. There is way too much to cover here. At the very least you should get some books on running a business and ideally take some classes as well. I'm not trying to discourage you, I just want you to cover all your bases so you will have the best chance at succeeding. Good luck!
 
Thanks, Netskimmer (you too, 2wheel) - it is neither my plan, nor my expectation to make a living from shooting for nothing and hoping for prints to be purchased.

However, I'm not a kid, not a student and not in the workforce each day without my camera. I'm out there, literally every day among the very same people who I hope would hire me. - - and rarely without my camera & gear.

I think it would be foolish to just continue to give my work away and/or turn down opportunities simply because I'm still learning what I need to know. Pricing per print allows me to take the steps I need and want to take going from Mamarazzi to Professional Photographer. Note I said "steps", not "leap".

I most certainly do need to know more about CODB, insurance, etc (license??) However, I took photos last week and this past weekend, by request, and have to provide them. I'll be taking more, both this week and next week.

Unless I either just give it all away, or worse, burn my reputation by withholding them, I don't have the luxury of time to fully educate myself. I can buy that time, simply by charging per print and donating a portion of proceeds.

Do you have a suggestion as to how much I should charge per print? Or perhaps, do you have a better suggestion that accomplishes the simultaneous need for current project fulfillment and proper business growth?

Thanks, :)
 
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Thanks for the explanation, Netskimmer.
Thanks, Netskimmer (you too, 2wheel) - it is neither my plan, nor my expectation to make a living from shooting for nothing and hoping for prints to be purchased. However, I'm not a kid, not a student and not in the workforce each day without my camera. I'm out there, literally every day among the very same people who I hope would hire me. - - and rarely without my camera & gear. I think it would be foolish to just continue to give my work away and/or turn down opportunities simply because I'm still learning what I need to know. Pricing per print allows me to take the steps I need and want to take going from Mamarazzi to Professional Photographer. Note I said "steps", not "leap". I most certainly do need to know more about CODB, insurance, etc (license??) However, I took photos last week and this past weekend, by request, and have to provide them. I'll be taking more, both this week and next week. Unless I either just give it all away, or worse, burn my reputation by withholding them, I don't have the luxury of time to fully educate myself. I can buy that time, simply by charging per print and donating a portion of proceeds. Do you have a suggestion as to how much I should charge per print? Or perhaps, do you have a better suggestion that accomplishes the simultaneous need for current project fulfillment and proper business growth?Thanks, :)
 
...I don't see how insurance affects how to price on a per print basis. Would you please explain and perhaps be able to answer my question under both scenarios?
You don't? :confused: Do you even have a business plan???? Okay, simply put: Insurance costs money, therefore to maintain your standard of income, you will have to factor that cost into your pricing strategy.
 
How much to charge is based on your expenses, your fixed overhead, and how much money you need to make to live. You should start by figuring out how much your competitors are charging to get a feel for the market.
 
Look, I certainly understand the relevance of ALL you're saying - business plan, how to price, insurance, etc... for when I'm fully "for hire".
Right NOW, however, while I'm still working on all of that; assessing and investing in my business start-up and maintenance, getting all the little and big ducks in a row, I'm still shooting.


However, I took photos last week and this past weekend, by request, and have to provide them. I'll be taking more, both this week and next week. Unless I either just give it all away, or worse, burn my reputation by withholding them, I don't have the luxury of time to fully educate myself. [and instantaneously have a proper business plan] I can buy that time, simply by charging per print and donating a portion of proceeds. Do you have a suggestion as to how much I should charge per print? Or perhaps, do you have a better suggestion that accomplishes the simultaneous need for current project fulfillment and proper business growth?Thanks, :)

All this advice is valuable, and I'm not ignoring it, but my question deals with a few immediate situations, which I consider to great opportunities to be getting name recognition and driving interest in my services when I'm ready to hang the shingle, so to speak. At the same time, it helps me develop my skills, taking photos I love to take, and helps the schools and temple get good quality photos that they want to have - even better if both they & I could pocket some money from them.

As an aside and PLEASE PLEASE don't ignore the question above - but - I'd like to post some photos for critique - but how can I share images of people who haven't yet signed a release? (I have releases for some) This question is for posting here in the forums and the same question for posting an event on my own site, so could be two different answers.



 
Look, I certainly understand the relevance of ALL you're saying - business plan, how to price, insurance, etc... for when I'm fully "for hire".
Right NOW, however, while I'm still working on all of that; assessing and investing in my business start-up and maintenance, getting all the little and big ducks in a row, I'm still shooting.


However, I took photos last week and this past weekend, by request, and have to provide them. I'll be taking more, both this week and next week. Unless I either just give it all away, or worse, burn my reputation by withholding them, I don't have the luxury of time to fully educate myself. [and instantaneously have a proper business plan] I can buy that time, simply by charging per print and donating a portion of proceeds. Do you have a suggestion as to how much I should charge per print? Or perhaps, do you have a better suggestion that accomplishes the simultaneous need for current project fulfillment and proper business growth?Thanks, :)

All this advice is valuable, and I'm not ignoring it, but my question deals with a few immediate situations, which I consider to great opportunities to be getting name recognition and driving interest in my services when I'm ready to hang the shingle, so to speak. At the same time, it helps me develop my skills, taking photos I love to take, and helps the schools and temple get good quality photos that they want to have - even better if both they & I could pocket some money from them.

As an aside and PLEASE PLEASE don't ignore the question above - but - I'd like to post some photos for critique - but how can I share images of people who haven't yet signed a release? (I have releases for some) This question is for posting here in the forums and the same question for posting an event on my own site, so could be two different answers.




Do you have a suggestion as to how much I should charge per print? Or perhaps, do you have a better suggestion that accomplishes the simultaneous need for current project fulfillment and proper business growth?

Several people have helped you with this. YOU need to do some leg work to figure out financially how much you need to charge if you want to make money off it. Or if your pressed for time like you say, look at other photographers in your area and start by basing your pricing off thiers (on the assumption they already did the nitty gritty financials). That will get you a start.

If you just want a number, $2.57 per 8x10"

You can post photos for critique, people dont need to sign a release for that. They only need to sign a release if you plan to sell the image via stock photography etc.
 
While I do appreciate and could use startup cost advice, I really need an idea as to what to charge for specifically the type of situation I described, where there is no contract and I am not formally hired. Forgive my ignorance, but I don't see how insurance affects how to price on a per print basis. Would you please explain and perhaps be able to answer my question under both scenarios?


This does not make sense to me. First why wouldn't you want a contract? Second, just because you don't have a contract does not mean you aren't "formally hired."

I would go so far as to say you are either hired or not.

What these people are trying to say is what you charge is directly related to your situation. Just because I charge x for my 8x10 does not mean you can or need to charge x.

For example, maybe I'm a full-time professional with a studio and a bunch of other expenses. My living is photography. My cost basis for a print is going to be a whole lot different than someone who takes pictures on the side or as a supplement to the household income while the kids are in school.

In other words figure out your cost basis. Figure out how much money you want to make. Plan accordingly. Read about how to calculate your costs accurately. Plan accordingly.

Good luck.
 

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