Are you born with it?

[spacefuzz]

If I made assumptions, my bad. However the success of your business Bitter clearly defies your own description of your business skills.

A case study to ponder, Laszlo Polgar (László Polgár - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) a psychologist who wanted to run an experiment about talent, actually recruited a wife and raised 3 daughters to be highly ranked chess players. He trained them from a very young age and Susan was olympic chess champion, Sofia is an international master, and Judit is an international grandmaster (by age 15!).

there is some data to noodle over, and doubters better produce statistical data showing the liklihood of 3 sisters being chess masters

Ok, out of those 3 girls which one is the best chess player? That one would have the most innate talent of the three.

I believe it was the youngest, which would make sense from the point of view that their father had perfected his training methods on the older two.

Another fun article which compares talent to practice: INNATE TALENTS: REALITY OR MYTH?

"We began this target article by describing the widespread belief that in order to reach high levels of ability a person needs to have an innate potential called talent. Because the belief in talent has important social and educational consequences, affecting selection procedures and training policies, it is important to establish whether it is correct. Belief in talent may also act as a barrier to further exploration of the causes of excellence in specific domains of ability.
...
The evidence we have surveyed in this target article does not support the talent account, according to which excelling is a consequence of possessing innate gifts. This conclusion has practical implications, because categorising some children as innately talented is discriminatory. The evidence suggests that such categorization is unfair and wasteful, preventing young people from pursuing a goal because of teachers' or parents' unjustified conviction that they would not benefit from the superior opportunities given to those who are deemed to be talented. "

 

[kiwizak]

I am of the firm belief that there is room for improvement in EVERYBODY therefore nobody can ever be a 10. But EVERYBODY should strive for a 10.

 

[Overread15 3]

10 only exists in the classroom - once outside in the "big wide world" it quickly becomes apparent that things don't remain on the linear scale any more.

 

[AntishG]

From my point of view, as mentioned by the others, creativity is (unfortunately) not something that cannot be learned.. Either you have it or not..

Regarding the artistic shot, I think it is possible as we should not forget that art is a form of expression that may be reflected by every individual in a personal way.. The aesthetic may be argued but art is objective!!

I agree with what you said about the most expensive equipment in the world being a waste without a keen eye.

So for me there are two important (compulsory) points that play a crucial role on in spotting a good shot which are:

Knowledge of techniques -

It is obvious that to be able to take a good shots, there are some steps to follow. Managing a camera is one thing, but knowing how to control all its features and being able to influence the effect and result is another thing.

Experience -

Once the techniques learned, experience is an on-going process that gradually leads you to improvements as learning from errors or even appreciating your work from a critical eye helps to reach the next level which can only be achieved with time and practice.

​

Actually i agree with you karen. As we say practice makes perfect. We, photographers, spend a lot on equipments to keep in touch with new technologies, to improve ourselves through our pictures (but like you mentioned creativity either you have it or not, it depends on the individual as everyone is creative in his or her way, some more than the others and others less, no one is to be blamed.) Experience is a great way to improve one's picture. I have been taking pictures for 3 years and i can say that i improved a lot from where i stood when i began. All this through practice and innovation.

A photographer must make one with his camera, just like a married couple, as his camera helps him to earn his living. He or she has to know all the functions on the camera by their finger tips, as this might help him to improve his pictures. But not to forget that nowadays, there's a lot of those so-called photographers with point and shoot cameras, taking any kind of pictures, put them on Photoshop to enhance them and claim they are professional photographers. We have a lot of them here in Mauritius. They invest more on the software than the hardware and they criticize you as if you are the outsider preventing them to earn money, when you sacrificed a lot to buy your camera and equipments.

 

[spacefuzz]

Actually i agree with you karen. As we say practice makes perfect. We, photographers, spend a lot on equipments to keep in touch with new technologies, to improve ourselves through our pictures (but like you mentioned creativity either you have it or not, it depends on the individual as everyone is creative in his or her way, some more than the others and others less, no one is to be blamed.) Experience is a great way to improve one's picture. I have been taking pictures for 3 years and i can say that i improved a lot from where i stood when i began. All this through practice and innovation.

So your statement just makes me have to ask, you have noticed no change in your level of creativity over the 3 years since you started on photography? In that case were you an artist before hand? I am willing to bet your creativity actually has improved, but its at a slow rate so you dont notice from day to day. Art in inherantly hard to quantify in that something that is creative to one person, is dumb to another. But creativity can be learned, and improved, and changed, and practiced. Why do you think one of the most common training methods for photographers I see is to pick a lens, and spend a day shooting only with that lens. You are in essence, practicing being creative by being forced to look at the world in a different way. Your brain then remembers that, and you can incorporate what you have learned into future photo compositions.

If you tell yourself you are at the peak of your god given talent/creativity, your only hurting yourself. You will of course never believe someone on an internet forum, and I cant blame you for that. But spend $15 and read one of these books written by people much better at explaining things than myself. Once you have the understanding that you can work and improve to be the best in your field, you will look at practicing photography in a whole new way. I think the $15 book did more for me than buying a D3x would have.
Amazon.com: The Talent Code: Greatness Isn't Born. It's Grown. Here's How. (9780553806847): Daniel Coyle: Books
Amazon.com: Talent Is Overrated: What Really Separates World-Class Performers from Everybody Else (9781591842941): Geoff Colvin: Books
and the main source for those books if you really want the hard science
Amazon.com: The Cambridge Handbook of Expertise and Expert Performance (Cambridge Handbooks in Psychology) (9780521600811): K. Anders Ericsson, Neil Charness, Paul J. Feltovich, Robert R. Hoffman: Books
Amazon.com: The Cambridge Handbook of Creativity (Cambridge Handbooks in Psychology) (9780521730259): James C. Kaufman, Robert J. Sternberg PhD: Books

 

[quiddity]

... But rarely can a 1 turn into a 10.

Should read: "But rarely does someone with 1 talent put in the effort required to be a 10".

It's all about mindset, some people are raised with an inherently growth oriented mindset and others aren't.

 

[mishele]

Mindset or not..........there is also this thing called reality.

 

[c.cloudwalker]

No, nobody's born with it but from watching kids I truly believe they are naturally creative. I absolutely agree with the Picasso quote in my sig. The problem is one of environment, education, etc.

If you grow up in an art filled environment as I did, you learn and you develop the EYE. If you grow up in a mobile home with redneck parents who consider black velvet paintings high art, you'll have a tough time remaining an artist

But every one can learn. It may take you more time and work than some but, yes, you can learn. But it does take work.

 

[spacefuzz]

But every one can learn. It may take you more time and work than some but, yes, you can learn. But it does take work.

I think you nailed it; improvement takes work, and its to turn a hobby you do for fun into work.

 

[imagemaker46]

No, nobody's born with it but from watching kids I truly believe they are naturally creative. I absolutely agree with the Picasso quote in my sig. The problem is one of environment, education, etc.

If you grow up in an art filled environment as I did, you learn and you develop the EYE. If you grow up in a mobile home with redneck parents who consider black velvet paintings high art, you'll have a tough time remaining an artist

But every one can learn. It may take you more time and work than some but, yes, you can learn. But it does take work.

I agree with most of what you said but there are always people that come from "mobile home" backgrounds that inspite of a redneck upbringing become greater than the environment they were raised in. As children they may not have been exposed to anything positive in their lives but beat the odds and aspired to be more. Is this learned or is there something within them when they were born that placed an amazing mind in a mentally poor background.

 

[spacefuzz]

No, nobody's born with it but from watching kids I truly believe they are naturally creative. I absolutely agree with the Picasso quote in my sig. The problem is one of environment, education, etc.

If you grow up in an art filled environment as I did, you learn and you develop the EYE. If you grow up in a mobile home with redneck parents who consider black velvet paintings high art, you'll have a tough time remaining an artist

But every one can learn. It may take you more time and work than some but, yes, you can learn. But it does take work.

I agree with most of what you said but there are always people that come from "mobile home" backgrounds that inspite of a redneck upbringing become greater than the environment they were raised in. As children they may not have been exposed to anything positive in their lives but beat the odds and aspired to be more. Is this learned or is there something within them when they were born that placed an amazing mind in a mentally poor background.

I think its something more like an event or way of thinking their friends/parents fostered in them that gives them the drive to work hard and put in the effort it takes to improve. Its different for every person, and whatever drives that motivation has to sustain itself for the years it takes to improve and get good at something. Its hard to keep pushing forward when you fail repeatedly. Of course its also hard if you start in a socio-economic environment where everything thinks you will fail so why try.

 

[quiddity]

Reality is wrong. Dreams are for real. - Tupac

 

[vfotog]

it's really obvious that some people here are confusing talent and creativity with technical ability. maybe they're so adamant because they don't have any natural talent? even as kids in elementary school, children have different abilities. why are people so threatened by that? and anyone who has actually taken an art class will know that students vary widely in their aptitudes and skills. There are students there that have amazing technical skill, often after years of "practice" but lack the creativity of some others. Technically perfect but soulless and dull and unimaginative. yes, your camera can do a lot for you, and you can master your settings, but that won't make you creative. you can use all the HDR and blending frames but it won't make your photography good. everyone can work to improve their skills and become the best that they can be, but to think that everyone can get to the same place is just delusional. Some people are born with perfect pitch; I can't sing on key. No matter how much I were to practice, I'll never be a Streisand or Sills. That's not defeatist, it's realistic. I'm more than ok with that. My strengths lie in other areas. But then, I embrace the fact that we're all different.

 

[mishele]

Ok, let's look at it this way.....savants are extremely gifted "talented" in certain areas, while they lack greatly in others.
These type of things happen over and over in extreme cases. Why can't we suggest that they happen on a regular basis in every individual, just to a lesser degree?

I think we all are a little bit of a savant!!

 

[subscuck]

Einstein wasn't the only great Physicist of his time. He was however, the one who created a new paradigm with his theories of Special and General Relativity. Some people are wired to see things differently, to think "outside the box" better than other people. Hard work, practice, dedication et al., can achieve the occasional flash of brilliance, but for people wired for it, it's just the way they see the world every day. Money can't buy that, practice can't achieve that.