Macro Lens and Extension Tubes HELP!

[PixelRabbit]

Ok this is the last thread I'm going to make on this, promise!

I have figured out what flash I'm going to buy and that leaves me about $800 to spend on a macro lens. After looking around at images from a couple lenses Overread suggested in the other thread (Sigma 70mm f2.8, Tamron 90mm) I've realized that I want extension tubes to go with the new lens and I think I can afford both but want to get the best bang for my buck.

So, $800 budget for an awesome macro lens and set of extension tubes for a Canon 60D what combination would you get and if you have examples of shots with said combination that would be even better!!

Please help me spend my money before spring springs!!

 

[PixelRabbit]

As I continue to research I see a teleconverter might also be a good option?...

 

[Overread]

What do you want the extension tubes to do?

 

[Mully]

Pix ...one of our members does excellent macro work ..... look over his site My Macro Rig - Then and Now | Up Close with Nature

 

[PixelRabbit]

What do you want the extension tubes to do?

I want to get Orionmystery close ....

 

[PixelRabbit]

I feel like such a goober being uneducated on equipment at this point.
The best way I can describe what I'm after is this....

I searched the lenses in Flickr, the ones that I picked out to be how close I want to be all listed extension tubes being used. Think 480Sparky, Orionmystery kind of stuff...

 

[Overread]

What do you want the extension tubes to do?

I want to get Orionmystery close ....

Then its time for maths

Basic math for extension tubes is:
(length of extension tubes in mm - divided by - focal length of the lens) + magnification of the lens at the set focusing point = magnification :1

For example a 100mm macro lens set to its closest focusing distance (ergo magnification of the lens is 1) with 50mm of extension tubes:
(50/100)+1 = 1.5:1 or just over life size.

Now a teleconverter gives you magnification times the power of the teleconverter; so a 1.4TC gives you 1.4 times the magnification increase no matter the focal length of the lens you use it on. So its 1.4:1 on a 50mm macro lens and on a 100mm macro lens. The focal length shift will also affect subject separation (longer focal length means an increase in blurring of background elements).

There are also close up lens attachments (diopters/macro lens attachments/macro filters). Now this latter group works very much like extension tubes in that you lose infinity focusing and your focusing distance reduces; but you can potentaily stack more power (higher diotper values) whilst retaining a usable setup (extension tubes tend to reach a limit before you lose more and more light in the tubes and the setup also becomes more tricky to use as it gets longer and longer).
Sadly I don't know the ready math for these, but at a very basic level they give you more magnification per unit of diopter value on longer focal length lenses (as opposed to the extension tubes which give you more on shorter focal lengths).
They do have the bonus that they are very fast to attach and remove compared to extension tubes.

Personally I've had great luck with a 1.4TC (I often if nearly always use a 1.4TC with my macro lenses - 1.4:1 does give a difference and since you don't lose any other properties of the lens you can still use it normally and retain infinity focusing - and your normal working distance). I've then also added Raynox attachments like the DCR250 (their MSN 202 and 505 are more powerful options).

IMG_0203 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
100% crop
IMG_0203jaws | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

sorry I can't find my ones with the 70mm macro and that shot is with the 150mm - the 70mm works well though and also fits with sigma teleconverters. (ps the Sigma 150mm f2.8 macro is discontinued now - if you pick one up second hand the price might not be much more than the other lenses new).

 

[amolitor]

Extension tubes are a fine thing. You can spend as little or as much as you like for these things. Vivitar has a set of 3 for $70 that will allegedly push you out 65mm, for Canon EF mount, that gets tolerably good reviews on bhphoto. Contrariwise, you can get Canon-branded kit for.. a lot more money!

Note that with extension tubes, you may not need a macro lens at all. Note further that the shorter your lens, the more leverage your extension tubes are going to give you -- a 31mm tube gives you a lot more magnification on a 50mm lens than on a 100mm lens. Um, always assuming I am doing the math right.

I would also consider a macro focusing rail. A decent starter setup would be the standard Canon 50/1.8, a rail, and a set of the Vivitar tubes. Under $400 for the set, and that would get you past 1:1, about 1 to 0.7, so your field of view would be about 3/4 inch wide or so.

 

[tirediron]

I'll toss in a vote for the Kenko tubes; well made, reasonably priced, and full control.

 

[Overread]

Also don't forget:
Canon MP-E 65

Whilst I fully advise getting a regular macro lens first and also experimenting with higher magnifications before shelling out - don't forget that - as a Canon shooter - that lens is out there in the market

 

[amolitor]

You can rent a macro lens if you think you'd be able to learn anything (mostly about yourself!) in a handful of days.

 

[PixelRabbit]

Thanks so much for all of your responses. I have pondered everyone's thoughts today and this is what I've come up with in my own special way (mostly viewing images captured with the various combinations of lens/extender/teleconverter)

The difference between the extension tubes and the teleconverter is negligible as is the IQ of Sigma 70mm, Tamron 90mm, Canon 100mm and the gain you get for the $ between the Tamron and Canon is hard to justify.

So, the plan is to get the Tamron 90mm F2.8 and a teleconverter. I decided to go with the teleconverter over the tubes because I can utilize it throughout my focal range on both the new lens and my Canon 18-200.

Effective lighting appeared to almost eliminate any differences I saw between the options and on top of the lens and teleconverter I am picking up a Canon 320ex flash by adding a little to a couple gift certificates I have for Sears That combined with some of the DIY setups I saw at Orionmystery's site should round everything out nicely!!

PHEW! Ok, any arguments against my decisions?

 

[Overread]

Are you sure that a teleconverter will fit the 18-200mm? In my experience most zooms like that have a very flush rear element (or even one that protrudes out on its own). Teleconverters all have a protruding front element, even the pro series Kenko (which has the smallest one and is still very good quality) has a protrusion. This physically prevents them being attached to certain lenses. Sigma has the next biggest with Canon being the biggest of all (although there isn't a vast difference between the Canon and the Sigma - whilst the Kenko is quite noticeably smaller).

Check that it will fit and with the macro lens when checking make sure to read "how" people are attaching them; because most use a teleconverter on macro lenses for more magnification many use a teleconverter and an extension tube together with the tube on the teleconveter so that it allows the protruding front element to slip into the extension tube and then onto the lens itself.

I don't know how the 90mm macro is setup - all I can say is that the Sigma 70mm will accept a Sigma brand 1.4TC without problems (I also assume it will fit a Kenko pro series teleconverter as well).


Note - the Kenko series teleconverters come in two kinds - you want the more expensive pro series as the cheaper series option is a lower grade.

 

[PixelRabbit]

Are you sure that a teleconverter will fit the 18-200mm? In my experience most zooms like that have a very flush rear element (or even one that protrudes out on its own). Teleconverters all have a protruding front element, even the pro series Kenko (which has the smallest one and is still very good quality) has a protrusion. This physically prevents them being attached to certain lenses. Sigma has the next biggest with Canon being the biggest of all (although there isn't a vast difference between the Canon and the Sigma - whilst the Kenko is quite noticeably smaller).

Check that it will fit and with the macro lens when checking make sure to read "how" people are attaching them; because most use a teleconverter on macro lenses for more magnification many use a teleconverter and an extension tube together with the tube on the teleconveter so that it allows the protruding front element to slip into the extension tube and then onto the lens itself.

I don't know how the 90mm macro is setup - all I can say is that the Sigma 70mm will accept a Sigma brand 1.4TC without problems (I also assume it will fit a Kenko pro series teleconverter as well).


Note - the Kenko series teleconverters come in two kinds - you want the more expensive pro series as the cheaper series option is a lower grade.

The research continues....

 

[mjhoward]

This guy uses a reverse mounted 28mm lens on a cheap 2x converter: Thomas Shahan!

You might also check out his video: