When will Nikon catch up/match Canon in Video?

[Derrel]

Canon's attitude toward independent filmmakers doesn't appear to be very tolerant. Canon Filmmakers has been notified and told they can no longer exist. They say they will try and keep the site up for a few more days, so if you want to see the site, you'd better get there before they pull the site down.

Canon Filmmakers

 

[table1349]

I guess my question would be, if you needed to drive nails would you buy a pair of pipe wrench or a hammer. Both could be used to drive a nail but there is an obvious one that is designed for the job. So what does it matter who makes the best pipe wrench if you are wanting to drive a nail.

 

[Nikon_Josh]

You may be right Patrice, it may seem like I'm crying in my soup! But its a shame that if your a Nikon user wanting serious video, you may have to switch Canon. The link that derrel sent is great also as it shows if Nikon will get serious about video, they would be better in low light situations.

But what also niggled me, was the hyped up D7000 and people claiming it would kill the Canon 60D. When in reality, I think the 60D looks a better buy. I mean the D7000 has innacurate metering and the supposedly superior all magnesium alloy body is only partial, also the AF in video mode has been proven to be a gimmick! Not bashing the D7000 as its a lovely camera, but I think it was overhyped. Alot of talk has been aimed at just 'how good the D7000's Autofocus system is', which was the most shocking revelation of all.

DXO marks shows the D7000 as having a superior sensor, but field tests show the 60D matching it in most situations. Camera labs said exactly the same thing, they said the idea the D7000 is a 60D killer is clearly inaccurate and were frustrated by the metering.

 

[Formatted]

Panasonic 101 > Any DSLR video

 

[Mike_E]

Not certain here but you may be spending too much time listening to people who own little more than opinion and agendas.

If you need more than either camera has to offer then you don't need either but rather the 1dmk4 or the D3s.

If you don't need high ISO then you need a dedicated video camera.

 

[Village Idiot]

Not certain here but you may be spending too much time listening to people who own little more than opinion and agendas.

If you need more than either camera has to offer then you don't need either but rather the 1dmk4 or the D3s.

If you don't need high ISO then you need a dedicated video camera.

Or shallow DOF? How about variable frame rates? How much do you have to spend on a video camera to be able to do 24fps, 30fps, and 60fps?

Canon's DSLR have the option of doing more frame rates than Nikon's. Comparing the 7D to the D7000, the 7D can do 24fps, 25fps, and 30fps at 1080 and 50 and 60fps at 720 where the D7000 can only do 24fps at 1080 and 24, 25, and 30fps at 720. Hell, up until fairly recently Nikon didn't even had a 1080p option.

 

[Mike_E]

Not certain here but you may be spending too much time listening to people who own little more than opinion and agendas.

If you need more than either camera has to offer then you don't need either but rather the 1dmk4 or the D3s.

If you don't need high ISO then you need a dedicated video camera.

Or shallow DOF? How about variable frame rates? How much do you have to spend on a video camera to be able to do 24fps, 30fps, and 60fps?

Canon's DSLR have the option of doing more frame rates than Nikon's. Comparing the 7D to the D7000, the 7D can do 24fps, 25fps, and 30fps at 1080 and 50 and 60fps at 720 where the D7000 can only do 24fps at 1080 and 24, 25, and 30fps at 720. Hell, up until fairly recently Nikon didn't even had a 1080p option.

Arguing with yourself again?

The OP mentioned "an interest in experimenting with Video". If he needed all that you mentioned then he would be long past experimenting and would be better served by getting a dedicated video camera.





Unless he needed a specialty camera like the D3s.

 

[Village Idiot]

Not certain here but you may be spending too much time listening to people who own little more than opinion and agendas.

If you need more than either camera has to offer then you don't need either but rather the 1dmk4 or the D3s.

If you don't need high ISO then you need a dedicated video camera.

Or shallow DOF? How about variable frame rates? How much do you have to spend on a video camera to be able to do 24fps, 30fps, and 60fps?

Canon's DSLR have the option of doing more frame rates than Nikon's. Comparing the 7D to the D7000, the 7D can do 24fps, 25fps, and 30fps at 1080 and 50 and 60fps at 720 where the D7000 can only do 24fps at 1080 and 24, 25, and 30fps at 720. Hell, up until fairly recently Nikon didn't even had a 1080p option.

Arguing with yourself again?

The OP mentioned "an interest in experimenting with Video". If he needed all that you mentioned then he would be long past experimenting and would be better served by getting a dedicated video camera.





Unless he needed a specialty camera like the D3s.

From your post you're saying he only needs a DSLR for video if he's using high ISO. Even as a beginner, one of the first things you're going to learn about are FPS and of course the shallow DOF associated with larger sensors and wide aperture lenses. 24fps is the standard for movies and you'll just a little bit of jitter. 25fps is PAL region, which is most of Europe. 30 FPS is standard for NTSC, which is the US. 60FPS has the ability to be cut down to 30 fps for a smooth slow motion instead of cutting 30 down to and having the image choppy.

Plus then you can adjust the shutter speed for which ever frame rate for some cool effects.

That's basic stuff like knowing how to use a camera on manual mode and how aperture, ISO, and shutter speed work together. If your only arguement it, "If you don't need high ISO then buy a video camera" then its pretty weak.

 

[Mike_E]

If you don't have a better arguement than, "If you don't need high ISO then buy a video camera" then whatever comes out of your mouth is pretty weak.

What I was saying was that if you are going to be serious about something then you should get the proper tools for the job.

Reading this internet guru or that one go into lavish detail about the most esoteric details about the least used features of product X vs product Y is a waste of time when either product will do their intended mission. Even a $500 Swiss Army Knife isn't going to have a fusion reactor because it's not intended for power generation no matter how good it is.

The D90, DX000 whatever are Consumer cameras and are intended for consumer usage. If you want to go into a discipline further than that, buy the right tools.

 

[Village Idiot]

If you don't have a better arguement than, "If you don't need high ISO then buy a video camera" then whatever comes out of your mouth is pretty weak.

What I was saying was that if you are going to be serious about something then you should get the proper tools for the job.

Reading this internet guru or that one go into lavish detail about the most esoteric details about the least used features of product X vs product Y is a waste of time when either product will do their intended mission. Even a $500 Swiss Army Knife isn't going to have a fusion reactor because it's not intended for power generation no matter how good it is.

The D90, DX000 whatever are Consumer cameras and are intended for consumer usage. If you want to go into a discipline further than that, buy the right tools.

And there are many videographers out there producing beautiful professional work with those "consumer cameras". Find a video camera that gives you the features and quality that a 7D, a few decent primes and a good sound recorder will for the same price. All that can be had for under $3,000. So you can find me this magical piece of equipment, that's a camera that will have the ISO performance, the ability to have such a narrow DOF and low light performance associated with that when needed, the ability to adjust frame rates, shutter speed, aperture, and ISO, the ability to use multiple lenses, and with something like a Zoom H4n can provide a package that can make professional video for under $3,000.

It's already been pointed out all over the web many times over than one season finale of House was shot entirely with a 5D MKII. Must not be that bad of a camera if it did an entire episode of a major television show.

 

[Mike_E]

This is starting to sound like a stand-up routine.

If you don't have a better arguement than, "If you don't need high ISO then buy a video camera" then whatever comes out of your mouth is pretty weak.

What I was saying was that if you are going to be serious about something then you should get the proper tools for the job.

Reading this internet guru or that one go into lavish detail about the most esoteric details about the least used features of product X vs product Y is a waste of time when either product will do their intended mission. Even a $500 Swiss Army Knife isn't going to have a fusion reactor because it's not intended for power generation no matter how good it is.

The D90, DX000 whatever are Consumer cameras and are intended for consumer usage. If you want to go into a discipline further than that, buy the right tools.

And there are many videographers out there producing beautiful professional work with those "consumer cameras". Find a video camera that gives you the features and quality that a 7D, a few decent primes and a good sound recorder will for the same price. All that can be had for under $3,000. So you can find me this magical piece of equipment, that's a camera that will have the ISO performance, the ability to have such a narrow DOF and low light performance associated with that when needed, the ability to adjust frame rates, shutter speed, aperture, and ISO, the ability to use multiple lenses, and with something like a Zoom H4n can provide a package that can make professional video for under $3,000.

It's already been pointed out all over the web many times over than one season finale of House was shot entirely with a 5D MKII. Must not be that bad of a camera if it did an entire episode of a major television show.

D5100 = $799.95

D7000 = $1199.95

7D = $1699.00

5D MKII = $2499.95

For $500 to $1700 more money depending on the comparison you'd think there would be a little difference.

Buy the tool you need and stop griping because this or that model won't do everything just as well as somebody else's no matter what it is!

 

[Overread]

Um Mike I'm not sure what you're getting at there - VI's point was that for the price of the 5DMII and lenses as well as support gear you could not get a similar featured dedicated video camera for less. It wasn't reference the Nikon DSLRs at all.

Also I think its important to understand that the right tool for the job has shifted - the 5DMII is a stills camera and very capable video camera as well - two for one

 

[Mike_E]

Um Mike I'm not sure what you're getting at there - VI's point was that for the price of the 5DMII and lenses as well as support gear you could not get a similar featured dedicated video camera for less. It wasn't reference the Nikon DSLRs at all.

Also I think its important to understand that the right tool for the job has shifted - the 5DMII is a stills camera and very capable video camera as well - two for one

Sorry, there may be some post creep (much like mission creep ) The OP started by bemoaning Nikon's seeming failure to match up their consumer models video capability to Canon's prosumer models. This then crept into all the great video functions available on some DSLRs while still moaning about the lower level Nikons and I was simply pointing out that you get what you pay for and if you want more, pay up.

 

[HurtNoMore]

AF101 Still has a smaller sensor than the 5d mkii and (18x13 vs 36x24), plus it only records in 4:2:0 so its not strictly dominant. It's also twice as expensive.


IMO: PMW3>>AF101.

I think Nikon really just hates that they have to add video functionality to their DSLRs. They don't have the same capital resources to make the big switchover like Canon does.

 

[Offhand]

Fact is that there is no real middle ground pricewise when it comes to video cameras--yet. You have consumer gear, which is fine for most people. You have DSLRs like the 5DmkII and then you have mid-ranged and high end pro cameras like the RED one or the Sony XDCAM, which is $18,000 for the former and $9,000 for the latter. Even with the extra gear to make it more ergo like monitors, matte box, rig, follow focus and everything else, it's still quite a bit less. Plus the Canon 5D offers more depth of field, smaller size for easier use in tight spaces or where you don't want people to know you're shooting video, good high ISO performance, cheap. DSLRs give you the most bang for your buck in video, albeit with plenty of limitations like rolling shutter, shorter recording times, only 1k resolution, etc. The new MkIII should really up the ante.