If You Have Nothing to Say, Don't Say Anything at All

[kundalini]

Valuable information can be gleaned from a positive or negative one-liner response, if the receiver is open minded.

 

[cgipson1]

Well, I don't know anything about the history between your communication.. so I won't comment on that.

I will say however, that you both seem like intelligent people and I've seen both of you post what I thought to be valuable information, C&C and insights.

Really?




















<yes.. joking.. sort of!> lol!

 

[ShooterJ]

Charlie.. you're such a damn trouble maker. :lmao:

Probably why I like you.

 

[The_Traveler]

The idea that offering a C&C on a TPF photo post will "improve one's critical thinking skills" is patently ridiculous. I mean, come on man...that's just a ridiculous premise.

?
??

The way we learn about an issue that we originally know nothing about is to study the field, learn the vocabulary so as to understand the concepts, try to understand how the concepts apply to the reality, understand a bit about the standards of the greater society and then figure out how our personal likes and dislikes can be linked to and described in the language of the issue. Then the person takes a specific instance and dissects the issues and uses his/her underlying knowledge and understanding to create a critique.

This works for judging wine, judging dogs, judging flower arrangements and judging art.

Learning how to do that last part, the building and exercise of critical judgement, is the most valuable part of an online community because the various comments provide the links between knowledge and the specific instance that builds a viewer's critical abilities. The more more each person exercises his critical faculties, the better they become.

 

[JacaRanda]

Are we allowed to take the good, and ignore the bad? Critique that helps me may not help another. My way is not the best way to everyone. It is so confusing when I get such different advice or critique from the experienced. It's great to care and have passion about my photography, but I don't own TPF. Enjoy the drama!

Food for thought.

 

[e.rose]

This whole thread is TL;DR... and I'm already doing a FABULOUS job of procrastinating at what I SHOULD be doing, so I'm not gonna go through and read it all...

However...

Shawn, I love you, and while for the most part I agree... there ARE times where "newbie" type responses are enough.

I happened to noticed as I was scrolling through, Kathy's response of only wanting to say "WOW!" and that's it. I feel the same way sometimes.

I'm weird. And what I'm about to say a lot of people aren't going to like, but SOMETIMES... when I see something that I love... I just want to enjoy it. I don't want to rip it apart and understand the mechanics behind it. I just want to say "Wow" and stare at it for a little while and just... take it in.

I mean there are certainly times where I see something I love and I DO sit there and analyze it, but sometimes I just want to enjoy it.

I'm the same way with music. My husband has a bad habit of sitting there and starting to rip apart and analyze and critique a certain song or band that I like, and I hate that, because it ruins it for me. I just wanna love it. Period.

On the flip side of things... sometimes I will take my work to my husband, before I bring it here or somewhere else to be critiqued.

Why?

Cause he's not a photographer. He has ZERO interest in photography. At all.

And sometimes what I want is the purest reaction I can get from someone.

"Hey babe, what do you think of this?"

"Something about her face is weird."

"Okay, thanks."

Ordinarily someone would ***** about how that's not specific enough. WHAT about her face is weird? (If I ask him that, he comes back with, I don't know). But chances are, I can look at it, after he says that, and realize... "You know... he's right... something about her face DOES look weird..." and being that *I'M* the one with the skill set for this, I can usually figure out what it is, and fix it. But he, without any photographic knowledge, brought it to my attention with a few, non specific words.

Other times I'll show him something and he'll go, "Looks good!"

That's it. Just "Looks good".

And if he thinks it looks good, then I know it's good enough for the general public, cause that boy and I are BRUTALLY honest with each other about our craft, so if he doesn't say "It's too bright" or "her face is weird" or... whatever he's ever told me before, then I know I'm good to go. At that point I bring it somewhere else for the "rip this apart so I can improve" kind of critique. You know... so I can improve.

But I don't find any sort of response invaluable. Some of them you have to work a little harder at to get the full meaning of it... other times people will spell it out for you.

The WORST kind of critique... is no response at all, in my opinion.

 

[The_Traveler]

When you play tennis with a skilled player, you don't need to say more than 'nice shot.'

Same with photos.

 

[Buckster]

The WORST kind of critique... is no response at all, in my opinion.

One of my early mentors, an artist by training and trade, said basically the same thing to me, "Whether people like it or hate it, the stronger the response, the better. That means you're creating art. It's only when there is no response at all that you're doing it wrong."

 

[unpopular]

The WORST kind of critique... is no response at all, in my opinion.

Which is pretty much the only critique I get ... and I have a sinking feeling that I might have ensured that for some time to come :/

 

[ShooterJ]

When you play tennis with a skilled player, you don't need to say more than 'nice shot.'

Same with photos.

I don't play tennis with skilled players.. or racket-ball... not because I'm afraid of looking bad or having to say "Nice shot" 500 times ... but because those balls are magnetically drawn to my f'cking face...

 

[slow231]

i don't understand how "it's boring" and "i don't get it" are not valid criticisms for something that is inherently about aesthetics. how is interest in a photo not pertinent to it's aesthetic value? how is not being able to discern the photographer's intentions or the image's potential value to other viewers also not relevant? i think in this regard the OP is missing the forest for the trees, a general impression is probably just as important (if not more) than any detailed impressions of an image.

I think a better point would be that if one can elaborate further and explain the reasoning (positive or negative), it would be MORE beneficial in terms of CC. but it's not fair to say that general impressions are not valuable. Also general impressions can't always be broken down into more specific details, this may be due to the inadequacies in the viewer being able to articulate/understand the reasons, or simply because sometimes (especially with all things aesthetic) the whole is not a sum of the parts!

 

[table1349]

...... Never mind.

 

[MiFleur]

This is an excellent topic that probably made a lot of people think back on their comments on other`s pictures.
I am sometimes annoyed to see post that seem so technical that you forget the radiating smile of the person on the picture to see only the lighting.
I am not a pro, I am an amateur who likes photography. I appreciate what I learn from this forum a lot, but I also appreciate having comments good or bad on my pictures, I personally prefer to have 1 line comments to no comments at all. But I have really appreciated the different points of view of this post and it will make me think more when I look at other's pictures.

Thank You Unpopular for bringing up that subject, thanks Buster for your interesting view on the subject and all the others that made this conversation enriching!

 

[Derrel]

The way we learn about an issue that we originally know nothing about is to study the field, learn the vocabulary so as to understand the concepts, try to understand how the concepts apply to the reality, understand a bit about the standards of the greater society and then figure out how our personal likes and dislikes can be linked to and described in the language of the issue. Then the person takes a specific instance and dissects the issues and uses his/her underlying knowledge and understanding to create a critique.

This works for judging wine, judging dogs, judging flower arrangements and judging art.

Learning how to do that last part, the building and exercise of critical judgement, is the most valuable part of an online community because the various comments provide the links between knowledge and the specific instance that builds a viewer's critical abilities. The more more each person exercises his critical faculties, the better they become.

Not sure that everybody here knows that you and I do not get along Lew (AKA The_Traveler, for those who are unaware of who 'Lew' is), and I highly doubt that most people here are aware that you've expressly told me never to reply to anything you post Lew, but...seriously...I doubt that after 35 years of intensely looking at photographs, and 40 years of making photos, that providing one or two more C&Cs on TPF will "improve my critical thinking skills".

What if I tell one more joke each day? Will I become Jerry Seinfeld or George Carlin caliber as a comedian in a year?

"Good post, Traveler. Nice stalking."

 

[Designer]

Are we allowed to take the good, and ignore the bad? Critique that helps me may not help another. My way is not the best way to everyone.

Of course! Take what you can use, ignore the rest.