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Losing business to amateurs

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I found it rather surprising too with a university because of my background and some knowledge of local sports and NCAA regs. (which may not apply if not in the states). If anything in my experience teams and arenas have gotten more strict and it's filtering down to high school level (but varies by sport, division, etc.).

I'd expect they'd hire/contact with a pro to better keep things under their control because it doesn't take much sometimes to compromise eligibility. (I'm thinking if an amateur/volunteer inadvertently did something not within guidelines the school might be limited in what they could do about it.) This arrangement seems rather 'loose' but it may be different than it seems.

The university near me laid off a photographer who worked for them but he got hired back once the next year's budget went thru. Varies depending on where you live, schools are funded but on budgets.

I wouldn't be surprised if going in this direction with it backfires on the school in some way but for the friend I guess it's a matter of this ending and finding another opportunity.
Much of that tightening is an economic issue. Severely limiting field access could result in greater control of the images which in-turn allows the venue/institution/organization an opportunity to squeeze another revenue source from the event. Often, when the school farms out security to a private firm ... the private firm really tightens up on passes.
 
[ These days, $15K isn't chump-change to anyone.

Wrong.
Apparently your private university isn't doing so good, but most "real" universities are.
Here's one from your neighbourhood UVIC that has a $323 Million annual budget, which is small compared to many of it's US counterparts.
Budget framework - University of Victoria

By comparison a US university ...
"The University of California’s projected operating revenue for 2011-12 is $22.5 billion to support its teaching, research and public service missions"
Yes, but when you account for the size of the campus, all the programs, salaries, maintenance, etc that has to be divided up between, $15K to one sub-budget is a LOT! DND's budget for the year is something in the order of 20 billion; expenditures of <$100 are being tracked and questioned. I stand by my statement.
 
I'm an art fanatic and alumni of the little nonprofit art school. Now, I volunteer to photograph the events. I'm doing this for fun, gain experiences, and supporting the school. Pretty much all the staffs like my photographs. I wonder there are pros in my area are angry at me because I'm photographing for free.
 
What areas of photography would you suggest aren't accessible to the weekend amateurs?

Corporate, catalog, products, advertising, technical, medical, research, legal, etc. The companies work business hours and expect their professional photographers are available during similar hours. They don't work nights and weekends, and that leaves many of the weekend amateurs out of that market, which leaves you competing with other full time professionals.

Area's that aren't glamorous, exciting, or fun, tend to keep amateurs at bay as well. Most amateurs that are in it for fun go after the easy, fun, glamorous projects. They will gladly spend a evening shooting a U2 concert and behind the scenes images for free, but ask them to spend 3 days shooting products and another 4 days retouching for free and the excitement fades quickly.

Another area are jobs that are heavy in pre-production and production work, with a crew, talent, props, etc. Producing these jobs require a higher skill level, a network of vendors and independent contractors, liability and errors and omissions insurance, and an upfront cash outlay of several thousand dollars (that can take as long as 90 days to get that back from the agencies), special permits, etc. All things most amateurs aren't going to tackle, don't have the cash flow to handle, and may fear the higher business risks.

Highly skilled areas, such as medical, high speed, technical photography, etc, aren't generally fun jobs for amateurs, require a higher skill level, industry background, or very specialized equipment. Those skills are used in manufacturing, technology, research labs, etc, which also means the clients are harder to find and market to, and again falls into the business hours while the 'weekend warrior' is at his day job. These are very good opportunities for independent photographers to become specialized and in demand with little competition from the masses.

People tend to prefer 'easy', which begot the phrase, "If it was easy, everyone would be doing it'. It wasn't as easy in the 80's, and not everyone was doing it. Its much easier now, and it seems everyone is a photographer :).

List all the fun interesting photography jobs people love to shoot, amateur or professional. List all the clients that are easy to find and market to. List all the photography jobs that are typically easily available nights and weekends. List jobs requiring skills easily learned quickly. Put a label at the top of the list saying "Jobs I Don't Want to Pursue'.

Then start a new list with some of the ideas above, and label it "Still Viable Areas For Professional Photographers" :)
 
What areas of photography would you suggest aren't accessible to the weekend amateurs?

Corporate X, catalog X, products X, advertising X, technical, medical, research, legal X, etc.[/QUOTE]

Not to sound like a phallus, but I know weekend warriors photographing for money in the above fields with a red "X" after them.

And I don't know that many photographers.

Just sayin'.

Even the company I work for which (in one form or another) employs over 10K people uses amateur photography for the majority of their photo needs.
 
Am I a weekend warrior or a pro? I dont even know anymore. Most weddings are in the weekend and I have a full time job.
 
Corporate X, catalog X, products X, advertising X, technical, medical, research, legal X, etc.[/QUOTE]

Not to sound like a phallus, but I know weekend warriors photographing for money in the above fields with a red "X" after them.

There will always be some in just about any field of photography. There are dozens of stories of some amateur somewhere that landed a very high paying advertising gig because they did something very unique and different that caught the attention of some creative somewhere. But at that level, its rare to have any competition from amateurs. And at the lower end, there are many small businesses and corporations that look to the amateurs to fill image needs.

But in the middle, from my chair it's mostly professionals competing with professionals. I shoot mostly corporate marketing and advertising, and I rarely run into competition from amateurs when bidding. I know quite of few of my peers, and rarely do they complain about loosing work to amateurs. This is in stark contrast to those shooting wedding, sports, portrait, concerts, theater, etc, which many are voicing their concerns.

All I was pointing out is that the competition from amateurs is eased when shooting for projects higher up in the food chain, and in areas of photography where the barriers are higher. I.e., requirements to put up 5K to produce a shoot and waiting for months to recover that in billing puts off many people (do a few of these a quarter, and you could be out $20-25K waiting for invoices to be paid). Submitting bids that are missing critical items signals to clients they might not have the experience needed to produce their project, and thus being passed over by client. The need to be available during business hours for creative meetings, etc. The need a producer, well trained crew, freelancers and adherence to employment laws. Liability and errors and omissions insurance required by contracts. Even having a good understanding of basic commercial contracts and bids eludes many amateurs. Things like these weed out many amateurs, not all, but enough to really ease the issue with competition from amateurs the higher up the ladder you go.

The more barriers that are in the way, the more amateurs and hobbyists that drop out. The higher up you go in those fields, the more barriers there are. All of these can be used to an advantage for photographers that find and conquer these barriers, as it brings them higher up the ladder where fewer amateurs are competing. The amateur and professional may have the same photography skills, but the photographers that have conquered these barriers will be further up the ladder with less competition from amateurs that haven't.

Add creativity, providing excellent service, and finding your own niche in the industry, and it can be very viable. Jumping in the areas that are most crowded with competition, amateur or professional, or worse both, and things look much more bleak.

I have yet to land a $100K to $250K day rate job like those few we hear about every so often :) I don't think they are too worried about the hobbyists and amateurs! And there is a lot of ground between the two extremes.
 
This post and your other post are heavy with excellent advice.

Corporate X, catalog X, products X, advertising X, technical, medical, research, legal X, etc.[/QUOTE]

Not to sound like a phallus, but I know weekend warriors photographing for money in the above fields with a red "X" after them.

There will always be some in just about any field of photography. There are dozens of stories of some amateur somewhere that landed a very high paying advertising gig because they did something very unique and different that caught the attention of some creative somewhere. But at that level, its rare to have any competition from amateurs. And at the lower end, there are many small businesses and corporations that look to the amateurs to fill image needs.

But in the middle, from my chair it's mostly professionals competing with professionals. I shoot mostly corporate marketing and advertising, and I rarely run into competition from amateurs when bidding. I know quite of few of my peers, and rarely do they complain about loosing work to amateurs. This is in stark contrast to those shooting wedding, sports, portrait, concerts, theater, etc, which many are voicing their concerns.

All I was pointing out is that the competition from amateurs is eased when shooting for projects higher up in the food chain, and in areas of photography where the barriers are higher. I.e., requirements to put up 5K to produce a shoot and waiting for months to recover that in billing puts off many people (do a few of these a quarter, and you could be out $20-25K waiting for invoices to be paid). Submitting bids that are missing critical items signals to clients they might not have the experience needed to produce their project, and thus being passed over by client. The need to be available during business hours for creative meetings, etc. The need a producer, well trained crew, freelancers and adherence to employment laws. Liability and errors and omissions insurance required by contracts. Even having a good understanding of basic commercial contracts and bids eludes many amateurs. Things like these weed out many amateurs, not all, but enough to really ease the issue with competition from amateurs the higher up the ladder you go.

The more barriers that are in the way, the more amateurs and hobbyists that drop out. The higher up you go in those fields, the more barriers there are. All of these can be used to an advantage for photographers that find and conquer these barriers, as it brings them higher up the ladder where fewer amateurs are competing. The amateur and professional may have the same photography skills, but the photographers that have conquered these barriers will be further up the ladder with less competition from amateurs that haven't.

Add creativity, providing excellent service, and finding your own niche in the industry, and it can be very viable. Jumping in the areas that are most crowded with competition, amateur or professional, or worse both, and things look much more bleak.

I have yet to land a $100K to $250K day rate job like those few we hear about every so often :) I don't think they are too worried about the hobbyists and amateurs! And there is a lot of ground between the two extremes.
 
She was probably aware that she would be displacing a paid professional, and it didn't really appear to affect her own calculation of whether it was worth doing (for her).

I actually think it's a stretch to believe that she was aware she'd be displacing the pro.

It's probably far more likely that she went to the university, said "Let me shoot for free and I'll give you pictures", and that was the end of it. The school, on the other hand, would have to be quite aware that what the ramifications would be for the pro. They just didn't care.

The problem here isn't with the retired lady (and since when does "retired" equate to "wealthy"?), it's with the university...
 
"Retired" doesn't equal "wealthy" automatically, but the OP explained that she is retired in her 40s because she's already made a buttload of money - enough to be able to provide photographic services for free while still restoring a villa in France. That kind of wealthy. So no, it wasn't assumed that she's wealthy - it was one of the known facts.
 
I have a confession.
When I was interested in becoming a male escort, at the beginning, I started giving 'it' away for free.
I thought that, if the experience was good, then I could start charging.
The reality was that all my clients told their friends that I was available for free and no one wanted to pay.
Oh, yeah. I got a few 'gifts' but people thought I should be grateful to do it for the experience and the exposure.

So after a while, I just opted out and left it to the pros.
But, I still get the occasional call; I just smile and tell them I sent me equipment in for cleaning and adjustment.:wav:
Thing is there are lots of new male escorts joining the party everyday [emoji23]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
So, on a side note, Leonore, as our etymological grande doyenne, where does "buttload of money" come from? The visuals are.... disturbing.
 
Wondering if she is feeling the heat from the other pros yet and if so, how that's being administered.
 
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